the look out honey coz im usin technology aka the garmin/powertap/srm thread

1506 posts / 0 new
Last post
white folks
white folks's picture

this was yesterday's ride, for comparison

cp2 by wheat flakes, on Flickr

distracted by ass pain

Wed, 10/26/2011 - 20:53
white folks
white folks's picture

bump to first page so he4th sees it

distracted by ass pain

Fri, 10/28/2011 - 11:22
halbritt
halbritt's picture

Sorry, missed this. Red dotted line is calculated CP for that specific time interval. The solid red line is your best effort for a given time interval. If CP is modeled accurately, then you should be able to produce the amount of power shown on the dotted red line for a given time interval. For example, it looks like calculated CP for 2m is around 525-550w and your best effort is around 100w less than that. If you're well-rested, recovered, properly warmed up, and not fatigued, you should be able to go out and hit 525-550w average power for 2m. As you get more data, the CP line becomes more accurate.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Fri, 10/28/2011 - 14:45
killing time
killing time's picture

is there anyone who doesn't use a power meter to train? im curious to know what program they're currently doing right now.

my coach has me running and jumping at the moment. 20x20: run five miles, find a steep hill of 20% or a big flight of stairs and run up and down it 20X, while doing 20 jumps from a squat at the top. then go put your bike on a trainer and do an effort for 45 min, 100c, 1 resistance while maintaining 160+/- hr.

also, my strava has my interval's average speed was 67.3 MPH.. it is not humanly possible to be able to push that type of speed. http://app.strava.com/rides/2097437

Fri, 10/28/2011 - 15:22
white folks
white folks's picture

killing time, i think i'm the only one here using a PM for training

he4th, thanks that clears up a whole lot.
I talked with Brent the other day and he was very knowledgeable but most of what he told me went over my head. i did pick up that he was mostly working in zones 1 and 2 and wouldn't work on ftp until much later.

question: this differs from my plan because his ftp has been previously trained to a high ftp? (ie he can just do a 4 week "tune-up" to get a big number)

distracted by ass pain

Sat, 10/29/2011 - 11:13
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #106)

truckdoug wrote:
killing time, i think i'm the only one here using a PM for training

he4th, thanks that clears up a whole lot.
I talked with Brent the other day and he was very knowledgeable but most of what he told me went over my head. i did pick up that he was mostly working in zones 1 and 2 and wouldn't work on ftp until much later.

question: this differs from my plan because his ftp has been previously trained to a high ftp? (ie he can just do a 4 week "tune-up" to get a big number)

I assume that you're referring to active recovery and endurance zones? That would be about right for an athlete in this part of the season that needed a "break". There are various theories about the benefit of doing a bunch of low-intensity work. The pros certainly do a lot of it, but they're on the bike >20hours a week and they're still doing focused FTP work. For amateurs, the general consensus is that not a lot of it is required.

Even still, as you go with your current plan, you might need to take a few easy weeks at some point in the winter, depending on how quickly you accumulate training stress.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Sat, 10/29/2011 - 23:39
white folks
white folks's picture

shhhhhhhhiiiiiiit
i got a powerspike of 40,000w and uploaded it to GC without thinking. now my CP chart is unreadable.
even after adjusting for powerspikes the CP zone 7 scale is maxed at 40k

went and deleted that ride, same thing

am i gonna have to reset GC and reload all my rides?

distracted by ass pain

Sun, 10/30/2011 - 18:40
white folks
white folks's picture
(Reply to #108)

truckdoug wrote:
shhhhhhhhiiiiiiit
i got a powerspike of 40,000w and uploaded it to GC without thinking. now my CP chart is unreadable.
even after adjusting for powerspikes the CP zone 7 scale is maxed at 40k

went and deleted that ride, same thing

am i gonna have to reset GC and reload all my rides?

ok fixed it and here's how.
delete the ride if you've already let it compute the spiked file into your CP
reload the file and go into editor
search for the spike using the "greater than" function
zero that data point and save the file
then re-open GC and let it aggregate the CP
should be all good

fuckin computers bro how do they work

distracted by ass pain

Mon, 10/31/2011 - 00:24
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #109)

truckdoug wrote:
truckdoug wrote:
shhhhhhhhiiiiiiit
i got a powerspike of 40,000w and uploaded it to GC without thinking. now my CP chart is unreadable.
even after adjusting for powerspikes the CP zone 7 scale is maxed at 40k

went and deleted that ride, same thing

am i gonna have to reset GC and reload all my rides?

ok fixed it and here's how.
delete the ride if you've already let it compute the spiked file into your CP
reload the file and go into editor
search for the spike using the "greater than" function
zero that data point and save the file
then re-open GC and let it aggregate the CP
should be all good

fuckin computers bro how do they work

You're getting good at this.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Mon, 10/31/2011 - 02:38
white folks
white folks's picture

its my new hobby

distracted by ass pain

Mon, 10/31/2011 - 10:45
white folks
white folks's picture

got 309w for my first 20 and 303w for my second today.
rest week payed dividends

distracted by ass pain

Tue, 11/01/2011 - 23:21
white folks
white folks's picture

one thing the powermeter has let me see pretty clearly is the effects of a proper warm-up
didn't structure my warm up and today's first interval was all over the place.
the second one was nice n smooth.

distracted by ass pain

Thu, 11/03/2011 - 20:25
white folks
white folks's picture

got over 310 for both efforts today. pretty happy with that.
wish someone else would post data, or talk power training with me :(

distracted by ass pain

Wed, 11/09/2011 - 00:38
halbritt
halbritt's picture

Have you figured out performance manager, yet?

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Wed, 11/09/2011 - 02:06
CheshireCat
CheshireCat's picture

just got my PT back. Time to start geeking out. Doing a test ride tomorrow. Rested last week (not really. had finals. No sleep and standing all day picking through dead people looking for muscles and nerves. Just finished my last today. Gonna be bringing the bike to the island. What could I do with an hour.

Actually going to finish in San Anselmo tomorrow cos teaching at a school there.

-is a cat
-is a REAL doctor!

Wed, 11/09/2011 - 02:13
white folks
white folks's picture

he4th, no. i'm still kinda messing around mostly. get me into it?

milin, maybe an ftp check up? or just a hard 3 hour all arounder to see where you're at?

distracted by ass pain

Wed, 11/09/2011 - 10:31
crabbi
crabbi's picture

Damn, I want a powermeter so badly. Saving up for a new bike, scooter, and quarq have got me singin' the blues. My ftp is 330ish @ 202.5lbs right now. I should be able to get a 20% gain if I stop dicking around and train.

Sneaky Viking wrote:
if you're here, you probably fucked up somewhere along the line.

Wed, 11/09/2011 - 11:54
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #118)

truckdoug wrote:
he4th, no. i'm still kinda messing around mostly. get me into it?

milin, maybe an ftp check up? or just a hard 3 hour all arounder to see where you're at?

Doug, are you putting all your rides into GC? If so, post a screen shot of your performance manager chart. Also, do you have your FTP set in the athlete profile?

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Wed, 11/09/2011 - 14:07
white folks
white folks's picture

he4th i am loading all the rides with power into GC, but when i got to the performance manager that chart is blank. is there some set up i must do somewhere else to load data into that page?

and i don't know what that second question means. i am unaware of any other FTP viewing than looking at my CP chart and that little dotted red line

distracted by ass pain

Wed, 11/09/2011 - 21:07
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #120)

truckdoug wrote:
he4th i am loading all the rides with power into GC, but when i got to the performance manager that chart is blank. is there some set up i must do somewhere else to load data into that page?

and i don't know what that second question means. i am unaware of any other FTP viewing than looking at my CP chart and that little dotted red line

I googled for the formula to calculate starting LTS (aka CTL) which I don't recall exactly, basically the number of hours you ride for the last three weeks divided by 7 or some such. The third or fourth link was "training superthread". I lol'd. There was a whole lot of "Dr. Wikipedia" which made it even funnier.

Doug, do this: Go into GC and look in the preferences menu. If you're on Mac OS, this is in the "Golden Cheetah" section on the menu bar up above. Click on "Athlete" and then select the "Power Zones" menu. There you need to add your CP with the from date of your earliest ride. We're going to assume that CP (FTP) hasn't really changed much since you started. From this point forward, getting CP and the "from date" correct for where you're at is crucial for performance manager to be accurate. You need to re-test FTP every 6 weeks or so. Assume you set your CP now, and you go in and set a new CP in 6 weeks, if you don't get the "from date" correct it will re-calculate training stress to be lower for all your earlier rides. Also, this field will get filled in by the "save CP" button on the critical power chart. You don't want to update your CP very often as it'll throw off your performance manager. If this doesn't make sense to you now, don't worry about it. Just set your CP and we'll revisit it then.

Once you have your CP set, you'll see data in the performance manager chart. Now is we need to estimate your starting LTS. You'll have to recall how many days per week you were riding before you started collecting data. Let's assume you were riding 5 days per week. Look back through your data and pick a ride or three that is similar in terms of length and intensity to the ones you were doing then. Say, one 3hr group ride, and a few other rides of various length and intensity. Get the bikescore from those rides and divide that by 7.

Say you had two easy rides at a 30, a couple of mediums at 70, and one at 150 given you a total stress accumulated in that week of 350, divide that by 7, and that gives you a stress score of 50, which you can use for starting LTS. Typical starting LTS scores are 30-50 unless you were training a lot. Alternately, just tell me what an average week looked like before you started training with power and I'll estimate a number for you.

At this point, you want to go back to the preferences menu, select the athlete, item, then select the "performance manager" tab and put a number in the "starting LTS" field around 30-50 as I described. Then close that window and go back to your performance manager chart and you should see numbers for STS, LTS, and SB. Once that's all established, we can work from there.

To write out this wall of text, I had to install GC and load some data. Now that it's installed, if you're inclined, you can start emailing me your power files. I can load them, check your work, and give advice as necessary.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 13:46
white folks
white folks's picture

ok, will do tonight.
today's 2x20s went really bad. felt like i had one baby leg or something.
did one at <300w and went home.
i knew this would happen eventually, but i had no idea how bummed I'd be about it.

distracted by ass pain

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 15:20
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #122)

truckdoug wrote:
ok, will do tonight.
today's 2x20s went really bad. felt like i had one baby leg or something.
did one at <300w and went home.
i knew this would happen eventually, but i had no idea how bummed I'd be about it.

Yeah, that happens. It's a good thing in the sense that it means that you're maxing out your capacity to endure training stress and recover. However, it is hard to take when you can't hit the numbers you're hoping for. Take an easy day, eat and sleep right, and start again fresh. Also, send me your files.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 19:59
white folks
white folks's picture

ok, emailed ya the screenshot. be patient as I'm really out of it lately.
super stressed out over other life-crap
my average weekly riding was around 12-15 hours until school started. mixed riding, all group rides with other cat4s and some cat3s.
pick an LTS number and we can dial it in later.
also, i'm unsure how to email garmin files.....

distracted by ass pain

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 21:05
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #124)

truckdoug wrote:
ok, emailed ya the screenshot. be patient as I'm really out of it lately.
super stressed out over other life-crap
my average weekly riding was around 12-15 hours until school started. mixed riding, all group rides with other cat4s and some cat3s.
pick an LTS number and we can dial it in later.
also, i'm unsure how to email garmin files.....

I've got plenty of patience. Sorry about your stress, man. I know the feeling. Get as much sleep as you can.

What happened on October 30? What's the bikescore for that ride? I'm going to setup a file uploading service on my web server tonight or tomorrow so you can upload all your files.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 23:04
white folks
white folks's picture

ok, thats the day i got the spike. i thought i deleted the spiked one, reloaded and edited it. instead its doubled :(

i have a lot of trash files (warm-ups, 2 second "oops" etc..) any clue how i can sort through for stuff 12 min and longer?

distracted by ass pain

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 23:26
white folks
white folks's picture

well dagnabbit, i fixed it again. still says bikescore is 302 and the PM has that big jump
it was a 50 miler in the rain, minimal climbing but a pretty good pace

distracted by ass pain

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 23:36
halbritt
halbritt's picture

I'd have to take a closer look at it. Bikescore of 300 should wreck you for a while. Depending on the pace, could be accurate. Good news is that it won't have that much of an effect.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Thu, 11/10/2011 - 23:56
white folks
white folks's picture

so i think i figured out my problem
last saturday i replaced the NDS bearing in the hub--it was destroyed and barely moving. i dont know how it didnt seize and spin on the axle.

then i forgot to recalibrate

doesnt explain my intervals at +310 tuesday though :(

distracted by ass pain

Fri, 11/11/2011 - 22:49
halbritt
halbritt's picture

Weird. Isn't your PT only a few months old?

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Sat, 11/12/2011 - 01:30
white folks
white folks's picture

yeah, its a POS though. i bought it because the bearings sizes were pretty decent for a 15mm axle. turns out it uses 6802 for the non drive. thats like a RC bearing...

distracted by ass pain

Sat, 11/12/2011 - 10:21
white folks
white folks's picture

bump
start of a new training block.
went out with my puncheur friend and got my ass kicked

cp by wheat flakes, on Flickr
ill get my tuesday 2x20s, but thursday ill skip coz outta town
i'm off all day friday. i could get something longer in...or should i do thursdays 2x20s?

distracted by ass pain

Mon, 11/21/2011 - 13:17
halbritt
halbritt's picture

You could try an SST ride. 90+ minutes at 260-270w. Shoot for 90m at a minimum, 120m would be good and 180m would be epic. I'm going to start loading your power files today. How many days a week are you riding now? Ideally, you're on the bike for 6 days with one of those being a "recovery" day.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Mon, 11/21/2011 - 15:15
white folks
white folks's picture

damn. i seriously don't have that much time.
i get 2x20's tuesdays and thursday mornings some easy spins on weds and fridays and usually a fairly decent ride on sunday.
oh and commuting about 12 miles a day in sneakers, lol

winter term should be much better for riding, but the weather woln't be
considering joining this cycling specific gym close to my work
$50 a month and they have cycleops trainers and an insideride

distracted by ass pain

Mon, 11/21/2011 - 20:06
halbritt
halbritt's picture

If that's the case, it might be worthwhile to move to 3x20s and maybe some longer SST rides to keep your TSS up. That'll make for a good "base". Hopefully, by spring you'll be able to devote a little more time to riding.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Mon, 11/21/2011 - 20:21
white folks
white folks's picture

jesus, 3x20 at or near ftp ? i can barely talk after two

distracted by ass pain

Mon, 11/21/2011 - 22:20
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #136)

truckdoug wrote:
jesus, 3x20 at or near ftp ? i can barely talk after two

That's correct. Try the SST first.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Tue, 11/22/2011 - 02:48
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #137)

halbritt wrote:
You could try an SST ride. 90+ minutes at 260-270w. Shoot for 90m at a minimum, 120m would be good and 180m would be epic. I'm going to start loading your power files today. How many days a week are you riding now? Ideally, you're on the bike for 6 days with one of those being a "recovery" day.

Did this happen?

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Sun, 11/27/2011 - 14:19
white folks
white folks's picture

no, i got stuck in eugene on friday :(
got a pretty good effort today and ill give the 3x20 a try tuesday. next sunday if its nice i'll do another ride with my bros, and an sst if its crappy

distracted by ass pain

Sun, 11/27/2011 - 20:40
halbritt
halbritt's picture

Given the number of days you have to ride, I'm thinking you're going to need a steady diet of SST to accumulate much training stress. Call it base building.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Sun, 11/27/2011 - 21:34
white folks
white folks's picture

really? i feel like im responding well to the 2x20s

my climbing is a lot better.

distracted by ass pain

Sun, 11/27/2011 - 22:05
crabbi
crabbi's picture

according to strava (who knows how accurate they are), my best 5min power is 618w set on friday. pretty stoked although i know it's wrong.

Sneaky Viking wrote:
if you're here, you probably fucked up somewhere along the line.

Sun, 11/27/2011 - 23:43
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #142)

truckdoug wrote:
really? i feel like im responding well to the 2x20s

my climbing is a lot better.

A relatively unadapted individual will respond well to any training stress. The more adapted an individual becomes, the more specific the intensity and dose of training stress must be. The good news is that you're making excellent progress on not-very-much volume which indicates that you're early in the adaptation process, but you're already making quite a bit of power. The potential there is pretty good. At some point, your gains are going to taper off unless you can accumulate more training stress. SST is a good way to do that.

I'm not suggesting that you need to change your present routine which you seem to have dialed in nicely. I'm suggesting you try an SST ride to see how it feels with a plan towards incorporating lots of SST work in your next training block.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Mon, 11/28/2011 - 19:13
white folks
white folks's picture

ok tomorrow will be tight
but i bet I can get 90m at 265w if my knee cooperates

distracted by ass pain

Mon, 11/28/2011 - 22:05
white folks
white folks's picture

so my knee was an issue today, despite eating a bunch of sardines and cheese last night.
a cursory glance at the file says 120m at about 245w :(
like the 2x20s, i find pacing to be the hardest part. i'll try again thursday.

side note: after i got to work, showered and ate, i felt insane for the next 4 hours...
felt like a major adrenaline hangover. hard to describe

distracted by ass pain

Tue, 11/29/2011 - 23:07
white folks
white folks's picture

distracted by ass pain

Fri, 12/02/2011 - 16:32
Larry Winget
Larry Winget's picture
(Reply to #146)

"His decline rate, or “fatigue resistance,” is also world class, as he only loses six percent of his maximal power over a one-hour race. That’s also a very important stat."

Sheeyit.

The Pitbull of Personal Development®

Fri, 12/02/2011 - 18:03
halbritt
halbritt's picture

I hate that article. It's so much bullshit.

"Wow!" "Wow!".... Right. Shut the fuck up.

"Average race wattage was 399 or 424 normalized. His max power was 1431 watts. He expended 1424KJ, had a TSS score of 104 and an average cadence of 80 rpm. Ryan uses a Quarq Cinqo power meter combined with the Garmin Edge 500 CPU.

Based on this one file, I estimate Ryan’s FTP (functional threshold power) to be at or near 415 watts, or 5.2w/kg – "

What an idiotic statement. That would make this file an "NP buster" and there are no documented cases of one. I believe Coggan has a reward for anyone that sends him one. The fact that it was an hour-long race, the TSS was 104, and NP was 424w, then I'd estimate that his FTP is... 424!

So, here's a man that that won a race among a group of pros. That means he's genetically gifted but still <6w/kg (true freaks of nature). Since he is the winner of a cyclocross race, he'd also be genetically predisposed to large anaerobic efforts and I'm sure he also trained for those as well.

The guy writing the article is freaking out and if you asked me to predict the power performance of a race-winning pro cyclocross effort, it would be exactly that. Even so, >400W FTP gets me pretty excited.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 15:56
white folks
white folks's picture

when you see him ride in real life, its kind of unreal. it doesn't seem right that something so big can move so fast and smooth.

forgive the shitty comparison, but it's like sitting courtside to a pro basketball game.

distracted by ass pain

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 19:55
Patch
Patch's picture

Most of the cross pros are pretty lovable too.
I swoon over Ryan

Sat, 12/03/2011 - 20:01
halbritt
halbritt's picture
(Reply to #150)

truckdoug wrote:
when you see him ride in real life, its kind of unreal. it doesn't seem right that something so big can move so fast and smooth.

forgive the shitty comparison, but it's like sitting courtside to a pro basketball game.

I get that. I'm not suggesting the dude isn't amazing. I'm just saying that if the dude is winning races, he must be fucking fast, and if he's fucking fast, his power file is going to reflect that.

...shift like jesus making one set of footprints in the sand in your time of need

Sun, 12/04/2011 - 01:37

Pages