Holy shit/Bike Shop lulz

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liquify
liquify's picture

Yeah, was much confused with that set of photos.

Fri, 01/12/2018 - 22:23
motorbacon
motorbacon's picture

Sorry

Fri, 01/12/2018 - 23:33
Rusty Piton
Rusty Piton's picture

So SRAM fucked up all of their brakes?
Shocking.

emor wrote:
Bicycle commuting is the worst way to get anywhere except for all the other ways.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 11:43
Endpoint
Endpoint's picture

They made hoses with the wrong caliper end fitting on them just said yolo and “fixed” it by shipping with the wrong banjo fitting on the caliper?

So the hold up now is the don’t have the correct fittings to ship out? Or is the whole caliper borked?

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 12:00
motorbacon
motorbacon's picture

That. And Ibis is now stuck with A LOT of Rival kitted Hakka MX frames that can’t be shipped out.

SRAM is sending me a complete shifter/brake set instead of a hose/diaphragm/correct elbow for the caliper.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 12:42
ThurberMingus
ThurberMingus's picture

Classic SRAM.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 13:03
Tail Hook Lengthener
Tail Hook Lengthener's picture

Why any OEM continues to gets in bed with SRAM is beyond me. The big guys dropped them like a hot potato after BrakeGate.

Sneaky Viking wrote:
when you look back at your life sometimes you see a set of hands on your keyboard and a set of paws, but sometimes there's only a set of paws and that's when Tarckbear was typing for you.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 13:12
sparksflyhigh
sparksflyhigh's picture

I'm curious how much, if any, profit the sram brake generate for them. Given the tremendous number of warranty replacements and the shop labor they're comping, I wouldn't be surprised if the brakes lose them money.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 13:38
sparksflyhigh
sparksflyhigh's picture
(Reply to #12759)

Tail Hook Lengthener wrote:
Why any OEM continues to gets in bed with SRAM is beyond me. The big guys dropped them like a hot potato after BrakeGate.

Which are the "big guys" to which you refer? I know specialized and giant spec a lot of bikes with them. Also, which one is brakegate? I feel like its been a long parade of incompetence and negligence that encompasses most of their models for years

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 13:47
Tail Hook Lengthener
Tail Hook Lengthener's picture

Trek and Specialized both cut their SRAM SKUs dramatically following the recall of the SRAM hydroshakes. I suspect that the prospect of sitting on a few million dollars worth of unsellable bikes for the better part of a year will force your hand. SRAM is starting to trickle back onto bikes over the past year, especially with the 1x fad in full swing and Shimano burying their head in the sand.

To be clear, I am speaking exclusively of the hydroshakes. SRAM brakes still defile mountain bikes every day.

Sneaky Viking wrote:
when you look back at your life sometimes you see a set of hands on your keyboard and a set of paws, but sometimes there's only a set of paws and that's when Tarckbear was typing for you.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 14:14
ThurberMingus
ThurberMingus's picture

Despite their mountain brakes being consistently shitty and needing service/replacement in the first year.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 16:27
motorbacon
motorbacon's picture

Talked to my tech rep and SRAM recognizes it’s safer and less expensive to replace rather than send replacement parts and comp more labor.

OEM dropbar - only 1x hydro shake option without left shifty bits is sram
Ibis now specs Shimano brakes on all mtb builds, including XO1 and XX1
Cannondale MTB are mostly all Shimano.
Jamis is Shimano

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 19:03
motorbacon
motorbacon's picture
(Reply to #12763)

ThurberMingus wrote:
Despite their mountain brakes being consistently shitty and needing service/replacement in the first year.

Too large of a piston in too small of bore. Here’s a new one: I’ve warrantied 4 eTap danglers for premature pivot wear. They would not shift if the chainline were remotely straight.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 19:13
Tail Hook Lengthener
Tail Hook Lengthener's picture

You're the second person I've seen or heard talk about prematurely worn pivots on eTap derailleurs. It also explains some problems I have run into, but didn't solve.

Sneaky Viking wrote:
when you look back at your life sometimes you see a set of hands on your keyboard and a set of paws, but sometimes there's only a set of paws and that's when Tarckbear was typing for you.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 20:17
NOVELTYNAME
NOVELTYNAME's picture

How many bikes are sold a year? Srs q

"Folks want options!"

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 20:45
Face
Face's picture

We gotta define bike first. Counting department store junk? Frames? Used?

Mr. Pubes wrote:
i fear that you are so lost in your own asshole that you may never be found again. do you have a flare gun? send for help.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 21:23
eric_ssucks
eric_ssucks's picture
Sun, 01/14/2018 - 21:55
drwelby
drwelby's picture

SRAM has had an ad running for a disc brake engineer for at least 6 months. I wonder if they're trying to poach someone who knows what they're doing, or if everyone who might apply knows what they'd be walking into.

Naturally, this bike is partially tarck's fault.

Sun, 01/14/2018 - 22:02
sparksflyhigh
sparksflyhigh's picture

I applied for that lol. They were very rigid about wanting someone with at least x years of experience in design so you're probably right.

Mon, 01/15/2018 - 00:21
NOVELTYNAME
NOVELTYNAME's picture

19.8 million Bikes in 2010

"Folks want options!"

Mon, 01/15/2018 - 00:33
mander
mander's picture
Mon, 01/15/2018 - 00:55
Tail Hook Lengthener
Tail Hook Lengthener's picture

My suspicions were confirmed yesterday: The mega shop at which I am employed has been losing money for the past two years, and if things don't turn around soon they'll be closed within 5 years.

I honestly couldn't care less.

Sneaky Viking wrote:
when you look back at your life sometimes you see a set of hands on your keyboard and a set of paws, but sometimes there's only a set of paws and that's when Tarckbear was typing for you.

Thu, 01/25/2018 - 10:26
jamesacklin
jamesacklin's picture

I had a dream my former LBS stopped stocking bikes altogether and devoted the entire showroom to faux-cork bar tape, Finish Line cleaning products, and cases upon cases of Rock n' Roll lube.

Thu, 01/25/2018 - 11:52
ThurberMingus
ThurberMingus's picture

That sounds incredible!

Thu, 01/25/2018 - 12:01
jimmythefly
jimmythefly's picture
(Reply to #12775)

Tail Hook Lengthener wrote:
My suspicions were confirmed yesterday: The mega shop at which I am employed has been losing money for the past two years, and if things don't turn around soon they'll be closed within 5 years.

I honestly couldn't care less.

Wow, really? Damn I'd love to chat and dissect the reasons for this I'm super curious.
The remodel and subsequent layout of the building always left me scratching my head it seemed such a bad use of space. They originally were going to totally tear-down and build taller with condos on top, but heavy resistance from neighbors worried about their view and the financial crisis put a halt to that. Lulz that immediately afterward a couple of new multi-story condo/retail spaces went in nearby anyway.

Is this company-wide or just specific to your location? Are the other locations doing better? Holler if this is too much for a public forum and I'll edit.

deadforkinglast wrote:
But honestly, I have no idea how I am going to follow through on that plan and I already have a pretty rad bike. I think I just like fucking with my bikes.

Thu, 01/25/2018 - 15:40
Tail Hook Lengthener
Tail Hook Lengthener's picture

Yeah, a little too much for the public.

Sneaky Viking wrote:
when you look back at your life sometimes you see a set of hands on your keyboard and a set of paws, but sometimes there's only a set of paws and that's when Tarckbear was typing for you.

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 00:04
motorbacon
motorbacon's picture

Holy shit, current mechanic (soon to be gone) of the shop I'll be taking over prefers to replace the bearings in external bb's rather than just replace the whole assembly. Or replace the seals in brake levers rather than upsell the replacement lever.

I think he's one of those guys that want to fix all the little issues at the expense of losing labor in order to say 'I can fix that'. I mean, there's no issue with being able to fix everything, but when you're taking 30 minutes to replace seal on a brake lever rather than 15 minutes replacing a lever, while being able to sell a slight more expensive part and confidently say 'this'll fix this issue'.....there's an issue.

I'm all for helping the customer, but we need to keep the lights on while assuring the customer doesn't come back for the same issue 4 months later when new parts tend to be a permanent fix.

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 03:52
lofarkas
lofarkas's picture
(Reply to #12778)

motorbacon wrote:
when you're taking 30 minutes to replace seal on a brake lever rather than 15 minutes replacing a lever, while being able to sell a slight more expensive part and confidently say 'this'll fix this issue'.....there's an issue.

If the lever can be expected to work fine for years with the replacement seal, that's a good policy IMO. Why throw stuff in the trash if it can be fixed by putting in an extra 15 min of work? Bill the work at a decent rate so the shop isn't losing money on it, the price for the customer will prolly be the same or less than a new lever.

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 05:17
motorbacon
motorbacon's picture

Because SRAM. It’ll be dead in 4 months.

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 05:38
Tail Hook Lengthener
Tail Hook Lengthener's picture
(Reply to #12780)

lofarkas wrote:
motorbacon wrote:
when you're taking 30 minutes to replace seal on a brake lever rather than 15 minutes replacing a lever, while being able to sell a slight more expensive part and confidently say 'this'll fix this issue'.....there's an issue.

If the lever can be expected to work fine for years with the replacement seal, that's a good policy IMO. Why throw stuff in the trash if it can be fixed by putting in an extra 15 min of work? Bill the work at a decent rate so the shop isn't losing money on it, the price for the customer will prolly be the same or less than a new lever.

You assume that the lever can be made to work fine with new seals, which is a guarantee that few experienced and qualified mechanics are going to make.

And when it fails in four months, you're in the awkward position of explaining to the customer that the $75 "fix" you provided wasn't adequate and they'll need to buy a new lever and installation for $100, and those parts will have to be ordered and it'll take 7-10 days, or else you're down the rabbit hole again, rebuilding a lever over what should have been your lunch break on a July afternoon with $700 of work remaining to be finish before 6:00.

Sneaky Viking wrote:
when you look back at your life sometimes you see a set of hands on your keyboard and a set of paws, but sometimes there's only a set of paws and that's when Tarckbear was typing for you.

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 11:30
lofarkas
lofarkas's picture
(Reply to #12781)

Tail Hook Lengthener wrote:
lofarkas wrote:
motorbacon wrote:
when you're taking 30 minutes to replace seal on a brake lever rather than 15 minutes replacing a lever, while being able to sell a slight more expensive part and confidently say 'this'll fix this issue'.....there's an issue.

If the lever can be expected to work fine for years with the replacement seal, that's a good policy IMO. Why throw stuff in the trash if it can be fixed by putting in an extra 15 min of work? Bill the work at a decent rate so the shop isn't losing money on it, the price for the customer will prolly be the same or less than a new lever.

You assume that the lever can be made to work fine with new seals, which is a guarantee that few experienced and qualified mechanics are going to make.

And when it fails in four months, you're in the awkward position of explaining to the customer that the $75 "fix" you provided wasn't adequate and they'll need to buy a new lever and installation for $100, and those parts will have to be ordered and it'll take 7-10 days, or else you're down the rabbit hole again, rebuilding a lever over what should have been your lunch break on a July afternoon with $700 of work remaining to be finish before 6:00.

lofarkas wrote:
If

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 13:58
oogens
oogens's picture

If the customer just starts jamming their foot in the wheel then it doesn't matter how the brake lever functions

oogens wrote:
If

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 15:37
ThurberMingus
ThurberMingus's picture

We get a ton of that at my shop. The two “head mechanics” always spend tons of time fixing little consumables instead of selling new parts that actually work. I refuse to spend any time or energy replacing a broken threaded axle in some dudes Mongoose when the replacement wheel is $35. What’s worse is that sometimes they take on these projects and schedule them for their day off. That’s usually by accident and per our “two day turnaround” but geez. It’s a bummer because I would send those people to the local bike coop but it closed down a year ago.

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 16:04
deadforkinglast
deadforkinglast's picture

If bike shops actually charged their stated hourly rate for repairs (which they don't, ime), then these situations should be no-brainers for the customer. $35 for a BB or $70 to replace the bearings and seals in the BB.

The problem with guys like that, in my experience, is that they (not unjustifiably) want to fix things so as not to promote a culture of disposable consumerism and they are willing to let the shop subsidize their stand against said culture. So they write the job up for like $15 labor.

What they should actually be doing is selling the customer the new BB and then taking the worn out one for themselves to repack and put onto their third beater. Everyone knows this.

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 17:44
deadforkinglast
deadforkinglast's picture
(Reply to #12785)

Derpl

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 17:45
ThurberMingus
ThurberMingus's picture

TC: I spent about 45 minutes yesterday trying to fix a Formula wet brakeset that I later found out was being sent in for warranty. I was trying to fix them for myself on company time. And in case anyone else had a problem with that set I would have a good fix for them :shrug:

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 18:05
deadforkinglast
deadforkinglast's picture

Yeah this is not to say that I didn't do a lot of fucking around on company time when I was a shop rat. That's what you get for the shit wages they paid.

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 19:47
motorbacon
motorbacon's picture

I love you guys

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 21:43
JUGE FREDD
JUGE FREDD's picture
(Reply to #12789)

motorbacon wrote:
Holy shit, current mechanic (soon to be gone) of the shop I'll be taking over prefers to replace the bearings in external bb's rather than just replace the whole assembly

I agree, but there is a case to be made for a smaller fancier shop

you get to stock just 24mm / 30mm (and some 22mm) Enduro bearings

you don't have to stock a shitload of different brands/models/generations/standards to match customer expectations, their cups get to stay visibly the same color as the other parts, and you get to tell them it's a fancy upgrade with your special tools

plus it gives you the ability to take care of the customers that you sold a high-end thread-together PF30 BB when they wear the bearings out

It's a struggle, but you cut out his tongue, and his last words are "atmo atmo Atmo ATMO ATMOOOOOGORIHGGHRSHGGRLMGGMMGMgrrglegurglegrr....."
– akasnowmaaan

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 21:44
deadforkinglast
deadforkinglast's picture

There's a case to be made if you're willing to bill for the time and the customer wants to pay.

It's not that I don't see why a cyclist would want that, just that the cyclist that wants that and doesn't want to do it themselves needs to get real about what that will cost, as does the shop. Some customers might be willing to pay that, but most wouldn't.

Fri, 01/26/2018 - 22:16
stumphumper
(Reply to #12791)

motorbacon wrote:
Holy shit, current mechanic (soon to be gone) of the shop I'll be taking over prefers to replace the bearings in external bb's rather than just replace the whole assembly. Or replace the seals in brake levers rather than upsell the replacement lever.

I think he's one of those guys that want to fix all the little issues at the expense of losing labor in order to say 'I can fix that'. I mean, there's no issue with being able to fix everything, but when you're taking 30 minutes to replace seal on a brake lever rather than 15 minutes replacing a lever, while being able to sell a slight more expensive part and confidently say 'this'll fix this issue'.....there's an issue.

I'm all for helping the customer, but we need to keep the lights on while assuring the customer doesn't come back for the same issue 4 months later when new parts tend to be a permanent fix.

Because the mech realizes that just because something can be consumable doesn't mean it should-- that trashing the whole assembly has an external cost far greater than the additional time it takes for him to do the finicky fix. Yes, business is business and the industry needs to survive, but in that case fuck this industry

15 minutes to replace the lever, but the lever costs $$$? Whereas the 30 min to fix the seal and parts is still $ or $$.

Sat, 01/27/2018 - 00:14
JUGE FREDD
JUGE FREDD's picture

sRMA will fully replace so much of their stupid shit for free

the best bottom bracket in the universe is a fuckin $30 part (DA-R9100)

It's a struggle, but you cut out his tongue, and his last words are "atmo atmo Atmo ATMO ATMOOOOOGORIHGGHRSHGGRLMGGMMGMgrrglegurglegrr....."
– akasnowmaaan

Sat, 01/27/2018 - 01:08
VT regularbike
VT regularbike's picture
(Reply to #12793)

JUGE FREDD wrote:
motorbacon wrote:
Holy shit, current mechanic (soon to be gone) of the shop I'll be taking over prefers to replace the bearings in external bb's rather than just replace the whole assembly

I agree, but there is a case to be made for a smaller fancier shop

you get to stock just 24mm / 30mm (and some 22mm) Enduro bearings

you don't have to stock a shitload of different brands/models/generations/standards to match customer expectations, their cups get to stay visibly the same color as the other parts, and you get to tell them it's a fancy upgrade with your special tools

plus it gives you the ability to take care of the customers that you sold a high-end thread-together PF30 BB when they wear the bearings out

Yes there is an exemption for every rule. Thanks for pin pointing this one, it's why we love you.

Miguel wrote:
i mean as long as we're spending money, lets just set the wallet on fire ok

Sat, 01/27/2018 - 01:11
deadforkinglast
deadforkinglast's picture
(Reply to #12794)

stumphumper wrote:
Because the mech realizes that just because something can be consumable doesn't mean it should-- that trashing the whole assembly has an external cost far greater than the additional time it takes for him to do the finicky fix. Yes, business is business and the industry needs to survive, but in that case fuck this industry

Two things:

1) there's fixing something for the long-term and making it work right now. It sounds like the dude is making shit work right now in a way that will cause the customer to have to come back sooner than if they'd replaced the thing, which is not doing right by the customer, atmo.

2) In the case of replacing the bearings in an external BB, fuck that noise for real. That's easily 45 minutes of labor plus the cost of the bearings, which wouldn't cost much less than a new BB, based on 2 minutes of googling. Assuming a $65 shop rate (which is on the low side), you're looking at a $60 job (conservatively) vs a $20 BB + $15 installation. At the end of that, the new BB is going to last the customer longer. If you actually write up the ticket that way and the customer chooses to spend $60 to not throw away the old BB, I guess that's fine, but I would bet good money that the ticket is written up for pretty much the same price as the new one or maybe even less than a new one.

Bike shops have to make money. Most of them don't and most of them die off.

Sat, 01/27/2018 - 01:11
emor
emor's picture

There is a time and place for making old shit keep working, and it is not at the kind of shop motorbacon works at (based on his writings and his very impressive salary)

"my main life goal is to have a dirtbag camper van with a bunch of bikes on it, go camping every vacation forever" -- me

Sat, 01/27/2018 - 20:06
motorbacon
motorbacon's picture

Average Household Income $234,071
Median Household Income $182,314
Percent Increase/Decrease in Income Since 2000 25%
Percent Increase/Decrease in Income Since 2010 24%
Average Household Net Worth $1,380,153

Blackhawk, CA Housing Market
$1.2M Median Listing Price
$1.7M Median Closing Price

Sun, 01/28/2018 - 00:04
emor
emor's picture

i wasn't trying to mean or anything. i understand you live and work in an expensive part of the US.

"my main life goal is to have a dirtbag camper van with a bunch of bikes on it, go camping every vacation forever" -- me

Sun, 01/28/2018 - 13:07
oogens
oogens's picture
(Reply to #12798)

stumphumper wrote:
motorbacon wrote:
Holy shit, current mechanic (soon to be gone) of the shop I'll be taking over prefers to replace the bearings in external bb's rather than just replace the whole assembly. Or replace the seals in brake levers rather than upsell the replacement lever.

I think he's one of those guys that want to fix all the little issues at the expense of losing labor in order to say 'I can fix that'. I mean, there's no issue with being able to fix everything, but when you're taking 30 minutes to replace seal on a brake lever rather than 15 minutes replacing a lever, while being able to sell a slight more expensive part and confidently say 'this'll fix this issue'.....there's an issue.

I'm all for helping the customer, but we need to keep the lights on while assuring the customer doesn't come back for the same issue 4 months later when new parts tend to be a permanent fix.

Because the mech realizes that just because something can be consumable doesn't mean it should-- that trashing the whole assembly has an external cost far greater than the additional time it takes for him to do the finicky fix. Yes, business is business and the industry needs to survive, but in that case fuck this industry

15 minutes to replace the lever, but the lever costs $$$? Whereas the 30 min to fix the seal and parts is still $ or $$.

you should replace pins on your chain instead of replacing.

Sun, 01/28/2018 - 18:03
oogens
oogens's picture

this is like arguing that the mechanic at the shop wanted to charge you $15 to replace your innertube when he could've put on a patch for $12

Sun, 01/28/2018 - 18:06
deadforkinglast
deadforkinglast's picture
(Reply to #12800)

oogens wrote:
this is like arguing that the mechanic at the shop wanted to charge you $15 to replace your innertube when he could've put on a patch for $12

$12 if you shortchange the shop on actual time of the job from beginning to end.

Sun, 01/28/2018 - 23:07

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